The preterist position that Ad 70 was the second coming and we are in the 'spiritual millennial reign creates a false 'safe' zone in that the Church is past tribulation and the Apostasy.
Both pre- and post positions place believers under the threat of becoming apostate, therefore, this eschatology is a more "sober and vigilant' position.
The danger of amillennial concerns separation from the world as this position has the World under the "Reign of Christ" rather than the Church at war and being 'in the World but not of the World"
The pre-trib position has similar pitfalls as it presupposes the raptured Church will not face the suffering and persecution of the Post-trib Church. Also the "Apostasy" (falling from the truth ) is viewed in error, as pertaining to the deception of the Anti-Christ after the rapture. Only "saved" saints can "fall from truth." "The spirit of Anti-Christ doth already work" is of course the cause of apostasy throughout history and a separate "strong delusion" in the last days will be the evil spirit's juxtaposed type of an end-time counterfeit out-pouring! ( and this is the LIE they shall believe)
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For those who are watching the prophetic signs and know the season is at hand, should understand that the spirit of apostasy through deception and temptation to love the World and the things thereof, is the greatest tool of the enemy and his ability to steal (our time) is how we fall into apostasy.
Today many Churches have reduced their service times to one a week or if there is a mid-week it is barely attended. Preaching and teaching should be increased, not decreased in order to prepare for this dark hour. But many Church members want what the worldly 'Jones' have and for a "bowl of pottage' sell their birthright!
The debate over the pre- or post-tribulation rapture should really be called the debate about the pre- or post-trib resurrection. The discussion is about the place of the resurrection in the sequence of end-time events. Will there be a resurrection of the church before the onset of the great tribulation of Daniel’s 70th week? Pre-tribulationism says that the faithful will be resurrected seven years before Christ’s return in power and glory. (This is a new teaching dating from the 1830s, never heard of before that time.)
Both sides of the argument agree that there will indeed be a resurrection of the dead after the tribulation. But the pre-trib. camp maintains that this post-trib. resurrection has nothing to do with the church — because the Christians will have been resurrected before the tribulation.
The two positions may be illustrated very simply thus:
A
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---SEVEN-YEAR PERIOD--
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B
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Pre-trib. secret coming of Jesus
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Post-trib. Second Coming of Jesus
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Pre-trib. rapture/resurrection of Church
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Post-trib. Rapture/Resurrection of Church
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The question is this: Where in Scripture is there a mention of a resurrection before the tribulation period? Consider these facts:
1) The Resurrection in Daniel 12:2 (“Many of those who sleep in the dust of the ground will awake....”) occurs just after the great tribulation described in Daniel 12:1, a verse earlier. This is a post-trib. resurrection.
2) The gathering of the elect at the sound of the trumpet in Matthew 24:31 happens soon after the great tribulation (see Matt. 24:29, “immediately after the tribulation of those days...”). This is a post-trib. resurrection.
3) The resurrection promised to the faithful in John 6:39, 40, 44, 54 occurs at the last day — presumably the last day of this age, not seven years earlier. This ispost-trib.
4) The resurrection of 1 Corinthians 15:23 involves all the Christians and happens “at the coming of Jesus.” Verses 51 and 52 describe this as a mystery which will occur in the twinkling of an eye at the last trumpet.
5) The resurrection of Revelation 11:15-18 (“the time came for the dead to be judged”) happens at the seventh (i.e., last of a sequence of seven) trumpet and this is after the time of the Great Tribulation, as both camps agree. This, too, is a post-trib. resurrection.
6) The resurrection of the dead found in Revelation 20:4 occurs after the arrival of Jesus to destroy the Beast and False Prophet (Rev. 19:20, 21). This, also, is a post-trib. resurrection, as all agree.
7) The resurrection described in 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17 occurs at the day of the Lord (1 Thess. 5:2) when sudden destruction comes upon the unsuspecting world (1 Thess. 5:3). This, too, must therefore be a post-trib. resurrection.
8) The gathering of the church to the Lord at the coming of Jesus promised in 2 Thessalonians 2:1 will not occur until after the Man of Sin is revealed (“The day of the Lord will not come until the apostasy comes first and the man of sin is revealed,” v. 3). He will not be revealed until "mid-week" when abomination of desolation occurs as he breaks the covenant, 3 1/2 years into 7 year period. This, therefore, is a post-trib. resurrection as a mid-trib Resurrection is not consistent with Daniel 12.
Daniel 12
Prophecy of the End Time
1 “At that time Michael shall stand up, ( and sound the last trump!)The great prince who stands watch over the sons of your people;
And there shall be a time of trouble,(armies of Antichrist surrounding Jerusalem/Israel & Allies)
Such as never was since there was a nation,
Even to that time.
And at that time your people shall be delivered,
Every one who is found written in the book.
2 And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake,
Some to everlasting life,
Some to shame and everlasting contempt.
3 Those who are wise shall shine
Like the brightness of the firmament, (The Changing from mortal to immortal in the twinkling of an eye)
And those who turn many to righteousness
Like the stars forever and ever.
When Michael stands up, he sounds the last trump! The voice of the archangel! 1 Thess 4:16For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:17Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. 18Why comfort one another with these words.
Where then is the pre-trib seventh trumpet in Revelation 11:15, where in Revelation is it mentioned?
Overlooking the primary evidence above, which establishes the place of the resurrection in the order of events, the pre-trib. argument may attempt a counter-position as follows:
(a) Maintain in Matthew 24, Mark 13, Luke 21, where the only gathering of the saints mentioned is POST-trib., that there is no mention of the resurrection and gathering of the church. This would mean that in the whole of Jesus’ discussion of the end-time and the Second Coming he omits entirely to say anything about when Christians will be resurrected and gathered! Though he speaks to disciples who are the foundation of the church, PRE-trib. maintains that nothing is said of the resurrection or gathering of the church.
Note: The “elect” whom Jesus instructs are the faithful church as Matthew 22:14 shows (chosen = “elect,” same Greek word).
(b) Maintain that the resurrection and gathering described in 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17 [(7) above] happens before the Tribulation.
Note: This can only be attempted by overlooking the context of the passage. Firstly, 4:13-17, taken without reference to the following context, does not saywhen this event occurs. But the following verses (5:1-4) do tell us that the event in question will take the world by surprise. This means that it is a post-trib. event, as are all the other descriptions of the resurrection.
(c) Maintain that Revelation 4:1-2, where John was invited to “come up here,” describes the resurrection and gathering of millions of dead and living Christians. This goes far beyond the evidence. Not a word is said about a rapture or resurrection in this passage.
Final note: 1 Corinthians 15:52 tells us that the resurrection of the faithful will occur at the last trumpet. Revelation 11:15-18 says that when the last (the seventh) trumpet sounds the “time for the dead to be judged and rewarded has come.” This trumpet sounds after the Tribulation, as all agree. Can it seriously be held that the last trumpet and the seventh trumpet are not the same event? If they are the same they provide absolute proof of the post-trib. resurrection for all the faithful. If 11:15 is not the resurrection of the church where in the whole of the book of Revelation is there a pre-tribulation resurrection? Where in the whole Bible is there evidence of a resurrection occurring before the tribulation?
We should be careful not to place our hopes in an event which the Bible does not promise. The carnal mind will agree with the enemy's deceptions especially if many of our family and friends walk the "Broadway" and not the narrow way scripture proclaims. Jesus made it clear that many "HOUSES" will be divided and turned against each other in these end days. Pray and watch!
Part 2 Parables, Allegories & Similes
"And Jesus answered them, saying, The hour is come, that the Son of man should be glorified. Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit. He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it unto life eternal."—John 12:23-25.
The Post-Tribulation Rapture View holds that the timing of the rapture coincides with Christ's Second Coming at the end of the Tribulation, i.e. Daniel's Seventieth Week. Those holding to the Post-Tribulation Rapture view believe Christians will go through the Tribulation. Those holding the Post-Tribulation Rapture view understand the real implications Biblical prophecy concerning the Tribulation has upon their lives. As opposed to the Pre-Tribulation view, which in essence offers an "escape" to Christians from the sufferings and persecutions to take place during the Tribulation; the Post-Tribulation view acknowledges the Church's part in the events of the Tribulation, suffering not withstanding. Now keep in mind, Paul glories in our tribulation, persecutions, and sufferings, because it builds our faith and desire to die to self.
1 Thessalonians 4:16-17, reads,
"For the Lord Himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air."
One also must look at 1 Corinthian 15: 52 to understanding the scriptural backing of the Post-Tribulation Rapture view. The passage reads,
"In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed."
Those accepting the Post-Tribulation Rapture view notice the similarity of the three things mentioned in each book: (1) the trumpet sounds; (2) the resurrection of the dead in Christ; (3) the living saints are changed (which all agree, is when this mortal puts on immortality and believers rise to meet the Lord in the air). Whereas 1 Thessalonians 4: 16-17 identifies the time of this as "the trump of God," 1 Corinthians 15: 52 further specifies it as the last trump. We also notice the Lord descends; he does not ascend. We simply meet him or apantesis him on his descent down. We do not go up and there is no indication anywhere in scripture He does either. All references indicate we come down.
Even more evidence of a Post-Tribulation Rapture is found in Paul's second letter to the Thessalonians. In his first epistle, he had explained to them about the resurrection and the catching up of believers to meet the Lord in the air; and basically instructed the church to not worry about dead loved ones.. (I Thessalonians 4: 16-17) Later, some confusion had apparently developed in the minds of the people concerning this event, so Paul wrote his second epistle to them in which he clarified the matter. In his remarks, he clearly shows there to be a Post-Tribulation Rapture.
"Now we beseech you, brethren, by (concerning) the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by (concerning) our gathering together unto Him, that ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand. Let no man deceive you by any means, for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed (Antichrist), the son of perdition. Daniel 9 clearly is the prophesy of this event where we see the Antichrist not being revealed until mid-week (3 1/2 years into last 7 year week of 70th week) So Christ will not come for the "gathering together unto him" of us, until he breaks the covenant.( *this does not interpret that he comes at mid point, rather it points to some time after)
So, in support of a Post-Tribulation Rapture, there is mention of two things Christians would clearly witness before the day of Christ's coming to gather believers unto Himself. There would be a falling away and the man of sin would be revealed. Concerning these very things, the inspired apostle said, "Let no man deceive you." These two points, particularly the last point, are only compatible with a Post-Tribulation Rapture. If we are deceived by this "false Christ" causing our falling away, ( which can also because of lukewarmness) if the rapture is 3 1/2 years before Antichrist is revealed, scripture is not true! The Antichrist must be revealed "showing himself to be god."
Even Christ's own words point to a Post-Tribulation Rapture. Shortly before His death, Jesus spoke these words to His disciples: "In the world ye shall have tribulation ..." (John 16:33) The verses that follow the prayer in which Jesus prayed for His disciples record what He prayed to the Heavenly Father. He said, "I pray not that thou take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil." (John 17:15) Christ never prays for us to be removed from tribulation, as it builds faith and hope.
Though it would be no easy task to take a stand for Jesus Christ, though they would be persecuted, though in the world they would have tribulation, Jesus did not pray that the Church would be taken out of the world. The Church was to remain in the world, but it would not be of the world. This is in harmony with the Post-Tribulation Rapture view.
Those opposed to the Post-Tribulation Rapture might object, however, that Jesus was praying only for His immediate disciples of that time. This is not the case. "Neither pray I for these alone," He said, "but for them also which shall believe on me through their word" (verse 20). Does this not include us today?
Those believing in a Post-Tribulation Rapture accept that instead of the Church being taken out of the world, Jesus taught that it would remain in the world to accomplish a definite purpose: to preach the Gospel. Jesus commissioned His disciples to "go ... and teach all nations" and in connection with this commission He promised, "Lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world (age)." (Matthew 28:19-20) this passage also proves the Post-Tribulation Rapture view in its belief the Church is to remain in the world until the end.
If the Rapture is not to be a Post-Tribulation Rapture, then surely His promise to be with the Church until the end of the age would be strange if it is His plan to remove the Church seven years before that time (or even three and a half years before, as those who subscribe to the Mid-Tribulation Rapture Theory suggest). If, when the end of the age comes, the Church would no longer be on the earth, a promise such as this would be meaningless and a Post-Tribulation Rapture view would be incorrect.
Among the Parables of Christ there is also evidence of a Post-Tribulation Rapture. In the Parable of the Wheat and Tares (Matthew 13:24-30) Jesus said that "both" (the wheat and the tares, i.e. true and false believers) would grow "together" until the "end of the world" - and then the harvest would occur, producing the great separation...
Though it would be no easy task to take a stand for Jesus Christ, though they would be persecuted, though in the world they would have tribulation, Jesus did not pray that the Church would be taken out of the world. The Church was to remain in the world, but it would not be of the world. This is in harmony with the Post-Tribulation Rapture view.
Those opposed to the Post-Tribulation Rapture might object, however, that Jesus was praying only for His immediate disciples of that time. This is not the case. "Neither pray I for these alone," He said, "but for them also which shall believe on me through their word" (verse 20). Does this not include us today?
Those believing in a Post-Tribulation Rapture accept that instead of the Church being taken out of the world, Jesus taught that it would remain in the world to accomplish a definite purpose: to preach the Gospel. Jesus commissioned His disciples to "go ... and teach all nations" and in connection with this commission He promised, "Lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world (age)." (Matthew 28:19-20) this passage also proves the Post-Tribulation Rapture view in its belief the Church is to remain in the world until the end.
If the Rapture is not to be a Post-Tribulation Rapture, then surely His promise to be with the Church until the end of the age would be strange if it is His plan to remove the Church seven years before that time (or even three and a half years before, as those who subscribe to the Mid-Tribulation Rapture Theory suggest). If, when the end of the age comes, the Church would no longer be on the earth, a promise such as this would be meaningless and a Post-Tribulation Rapture view would be incorrect.
Among the Parables of Christ there is also evidence of a Post-Tribulation Rapture. In the Parable of the Wheat and Tares (Matthew 13:24-30) Jesus said that "both" (the wheat and the tares, i.e. true and false believers) would grow "together" until the "end of the world" - and then the harvest would occur, producing the great separation...
First the "tares"...How is this so? The key is the words..."bind them in bundles" to burn refers to a later time as in the lake of fire. "Bind them in bundles" is "The strong delusion" God sends to all who love not the truth.!"
When God sends this "Judgement" ...this is the separation!
12That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
The harvest occurs at the end of the age, and it is at the time of the harvest that the rapture will occur - and the tares will then be gathered up and burned. The Post-Tribulation Rapture view fits neatly with this parable as it does with all the parables.
Those believing in a Post-Tribulation Rapture also make special note of Christ's words in the Gospel of John:
"And this is the will of Him that sent me," Jesus said, "that everyone which seeth the Son, and believeth on Him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up "at the last day." (John 6:40, 44)
Again and in further support of the Post-Tribulation Rapture view, He repeated the words in verse 54: "I will raise him up at the last day." The last day is the final day we see in Revelation 10 and 11 when time is no longer.
With this evidence in mind, certain conclusions are apparent that point to a Post-Tribulation Rapture. Since the "catching up" or Rapture occurs at the same time as the Resurrection of the dead in Christ (I Thessalonians 4:16, 17), it is plain to see that the Rapture is to be a Post-Tribulation Rapture and will take place at the last day and not seven years (or 3 1/2 years) before the last day.
Those believing in a Post-Tribulation Rapture also make special note of Christ's words in the Gospel of John:
"And this is the will of Him that sent me," Jesus said, "that everyone which seeth the Son, and believeth on Him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up "at the last day." (John 6:40, 44)
Again and in further support of the Post-Tribulation Rapture view, He repeated the words in verse 54: "I will raise him up at the last day." The last day is the final day we see in Revelation 10 and 11 when time is no longer.
With this evidence in mind, certain conclusions are apparent that point to a Post-Tribulation Rapture. Since the "catching up" or Rapture occurs at the same time as the Resurrection of the dead in Christ (I Thessalonians 4:16, 17), it is plain to see that the Rapture is to be a Post-Tribulation Rapture and will take place at the last day and not seven years (or 3 1/2 years) before the last day.
While those believing The Post Trib view would likely be overjoyed to find themselves wrong, there will be much confusion for those believing The Pre-Trib view for their faith in their teachers will crumble as they realize "God is not the author of confusion." How will they trust these Shepherds to lead them through Tribulation?
I agree with your analysis. I too believe the Bible teaches post tribulation.
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